Why Families Need to Talk About Money Before It’s Too Late

The most important inheritance conversations are about trust, context, and relationships.

Emily Bouchard, TEDx speaker, founder of Family Focused Wealth, and host of the Wealth Coherence Podcast joins Tony on the Get Ready Before Life Happens podcast to talk about why families need safe, transparent conversations around money, trust, and inheritance.

They explore how trust, communication, and shared values help families build resilience, prepare beneficiaries, and reduce the emotional impact of inheritance and loss.

Key Takeaways

🔹 Inheritance conversations should focus on relationships before numbers.

🔹 Safe spaces allow families to share concerns, values, and expectations.

🔹 Trust is built through sincerity, reliability, competence, and care.

🔹 Beneficiaries need context and preparation, not just financial assets.

🔹 Lack of communication can increase inheritance trauma and confusion.

🔹 Understanding each other’s money stories strengthens family resilience.

🔹 Small, consistent conversations build trust and clarity over time.

🧠 Tony’s Take

Money changes family dynamics the moment it enters the room. Financial readiness means creating trust, context, and safe conversations before decisions are forced by life transitions.

Connect with Emily Bouchard:

• Website: https://emilybouchard.com
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emily-bouchard-5a9a049/
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/emily4families/

Books:

• Beginners Guide to Purposeful Prenups: Three Essential Elements for a Successful Prenup Conversation by Emily Bouchard and Emily Chase Smith (Amazon)
• Estate Planning for the Blended Family by L. Paul Hood, Jr. and Emily Bouchard (Amazon)

Podcast:

• Wealth Coherence Podcast: https://emilybouchard.com/podcasts/

Resources mentioned:

• TEDx Talk: How to talk about inheritance (without talking about money) - (YouTube) 
• The Five Dysfunctions of a Team: A Leadership Fable by Patrick Lencioni (Amazon)

Bio: 

Emily Bouchard is a coach and consultant to enterprising families and is dedicated to unlocking the full potential of individuals, couples and families, by guiding them through the complexities of wealth, relationships, and leadership. She is an author and speaker with over 20 years of experience coaching multigenerational families, with specializations in blended family dynamics and family business succession. As a fractional Chief Learning Officer, she designs personalized learning experiences that focus on lifelong growth, emotional intelligence, and financial acumen. She lives on 10-acres with 9 horses, where she facilitates transformative retreats.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:04

Get ready before life happens, the podcast helping you navigate life's blood end.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Most money challenges are really about trust, communication, and the questions families often don't get around to asking. Welcome to Get Ready Before Life Happens. I'm pleased to be joined today by Emily Bouchard. Emily, welcome to the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Thanks so much. I'm so delighted to be here.

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Yeah, I'm honored to have you on the show. You've got a great message. So, you know, excited to jump into this. So tell us a little bit about yourself. What is your origin story and how did it lead you to focus on family dynamics?

SPEAKER_01 0:47

Oh, yeah. That if you want to know my origin story, you can listen to my TEDx talk, how to talk about inheritance without talking about money. I go into some detail about that. But basically, um, when my mother died really suddenly of a cerebral hemorrhage, uh, my nobody in my family knew how to talk about issues that really mattered to us. And uh it was, I was 14 at the time. It was very challenging, and I really saw how my family was impacted, and uh, we ended up becoming like really distant from my mom's family as a result, and uh it just was so sad. And I ended up being very interested in this impact on me. I did a degree in child development that I got to create because my university didn't have that as a course, and I did a whole study on what is it like to be impacted by an illness when you're a teenager and you become a young adult. I was really interested in child development from that stage, like um coming into your own adulthood and uh when there's a trauma that happens when you're a teenager. And I ended up becoming a child life specialist and working in hospitals, and I saw the impact on the whole family system when a child was sick, and that led me to get a social work degree and a specialty in marital and family therapy to see if I could help families uh navigate and be resilient in the face of major challenges. And then I uh became a stepparent. I became a stepmom to two teenagers, and I got to take all of this knowledge I'd taken and learned in school and apply it in my family, and had quite an extraordinary experience being a stepmom. And then my 19-year-old stepdaughter had a baby. Uh, and so I got to be a step-grandmother really early on and learned a ton uh, you know, in the trenches with my family. And I ended up being referred by a colleague uh to a consulting firm that worked with uh families with operating businesses that were looking at how to prepare the next generation for the ownership in the family business, or if they weren't gonna be working in the business, how to interface with the family members that were, or if they were gonna sell it, what to do with this money that they had, um, or if there were contentions among shared ownership and needing to look at exit strategies. So really contentious, emotionally charged issues related to something that was really at stake. Um, and I became a listening coach for this firm uh because of my specialty in uh youth and uh education and then uh family dynamics around very challenging topics and issues. And that was in 2004. So I've been doing it for over 20 years, which is kind of crazy to think about. And I didn't know it existed when I went to social work school, like working with now they're termed ultra-high net worth families. That term didn't really wasn't used when I was starting out in 2004, was more, you know, just enterprising families that had amassed quite a bit of financial resources. Um and yeah, thus looking at how to um have families do well and be really resilient, and learning that when you have significant wealth, it's kind of amplifies whatever is in the space in the family dynamics and makes them bigger and more challenging. And I learned through research how at risk the youth are in these families. Um, and it's surprising for people to learn that, right? You know, the poor little rich kids, but uh they they actually have access to so many resources and um things that aren't necessarily the best for them. And then they also tend to miss out on some of the natural repercussions or consequences of behavior because they can be rescued because money can pay for really great lawyers or um influence. So uh they don't end up hitting those roadblocks in life at younger ages, and then it it really can set them up for very challenging lives as a result. So I got really passionate about wow, I can really make a difference for these families, and then there's a a huge ripple ripple effect that happens for them because of their employees and their communities that they serve in many ways, and their customers. So, you know, you have those families. There's only one of me, right? So I've ended up sticking with this population and um supporting those families and having successful relationships.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

Yeah. Well, what is the rap song? More money, more problems. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um so for for people watching and listening, I'll be linking to Emily's uh TEDx talk, so you can definitely check it out. It's a great TEDx talk. So recommend checking that out. Um and you know what you say is I I think that people do miss that. Um, you know, we're not gonna really talk too much about wealthy families. It's not the point of the show, but I think what you say is that what's important is there's always issues, no matter who you are or what you think somebody else has achieved. And I think that's the really important takeaway. I've worked with some high net worth uh families as well, and it's just it's different issues. And I think that's what's important to remember. There's always a family dynamic. Um I want to walk back to something you said as a listening coach because I think that's listening is a superpower. I mean, what is a listening coach? How would you define that?

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Uh well, my role in that particular consulting firm was to meet every member of the family that was 16 years or older, and they could be people that married in or were living with somebody that people that were engaged in the family in some way. And I would have interviews with them and they would be anywhere from an hour to an hour and a half to three, four hours. I can't tell you how many founders I've, you know, asked them to block out three hours and then like, oh, this isn't going to take more than 30 minutes. And then like three hours later, they're like, wait, can we continue? Because, you know, having a dedicated listener that also asks really probing questions around things that matter the most to you is a real, that's a real luxury. And that was my role was to just learn as much as I possibly could about the family, the family dynamics, the situation, like skeletons in the closet, the stuff that's swept under the rug, you know, the what ifs, um, the typical dynamics that can happen, like, um, oh, if you bring up this topic, what happens? Or if there's a bit of a conflict, how is it addressed? And then in the meetings, when we would have all these family members together and we would be teaching them skills around communication and trust, they uh would I would bring relevance to the conversation. And I wouldn't have it be about any one person in particular, but more families like yours will often experience something like this and make it normalize it and make it so that no one person has to risk sticking their neck out. Um, but that their concerns that I know are in the room get addressed. So that is my role.

SPEAKER_00 8:05

I I I love that one. I think that's something really powerful when we're talking about listening is that you know, people think, well, you know, this will only take a half hour, but it it's incredible when you start listening to people and act actively listening, how the conversation changes, the information that you get. And so it, you know, it definitely sounds like that was the process because you were actually listening people talk for longer than they planned to, which is incredible.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

And I often liken it to being handed a beautiful gemstone, you know, like the Hope Diamond. And I let everybody know, like when I'm coming in, I want to hear life through your facet. I want to see the world through how you see it. And presume I know nothing. Like, um, I'm not gonna be bringing any information from prior interviews, and I'm not gonna be tearing with anybody what you tell me. How do you see the world? And then you understand they all understand that when I'm done, I can see the whole gem. They can only see the world through their lens and then how it refracts through the other ones, but I can actually see the whole gem, where the imperfections are, where the beauty shines through, and I can really help them understand how to like maximize the opportunity they have with it as a family.

SPEAKER_00 9:19

So yeah, and I think that's something important, you know. I I you know, when I was a consultant, is that was something I definitely saw is that you know, you have to understand where, you know, in my case, where the client was coming from and what their outlook was rather than just coming, you know, with a solution, you know, because it's so easy as a professional to say, okay, I have the solution, and you know, but it's not the solution that people are looking for. And uh, you know, and that's where trouble happens.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Definitely.

SPEAKER_00 9:51

Yeah. So, you know, what do families miss when inheritance conversations focus only on money?

SPEAKER_01 10:01

Oh so I often recommend having money be the least important part of it because, in a sense, you don't know how much money is going to be there when the money transfers, or even if it does transfer, when it things typically become accessible or utilized in different ways during um a major time of transition. Like a parent has passed away, a grandparent has passed away, or uh maybe there's been a liquidity event that's caused it to happen. Um, and so the most important thing is to really get clear on what the purpose is of the family and of whatever resources you have. It doesn't have to be huge wealth either. It can be as simple as the house, right? You have three kids, you have one house, and you have a wife from a second marriage who's in the house. How does this look? If you're gonna transfer the ownership of the house to the three kids, but their stepmom's in the house, yeah, is she gonna be paying rent to them? Is she like so you really want to start with what's our relationships to each other? What's our purpose of this? What with what we have, what do we want to have happen in each other's lives because of it? Kind of the wishes and hopes, and then also the concerns or worries. And a lot of people have trouble having these conversations because of their concern about it not being equal, right? Like if it's not equal, somebody's gonna say it's not fair and somebody's gonna be unhappy with what you've chosen. But maybe there's somebody who has a special need or a child that has a special need, and so you want to create a special trust for that child. Um, and somebody else is doing really well in their work, and you know that they're gonna be totally fine financially. But how do you set it up and talk about it in such a way that everybody feels like you they understand what your thought process was, uh they understand what your hopes are for them and why you've set it up the way you have. And that can make such a difference in terms of how people experience it when you're no longer there and they have to deal with the um how the plan was laid out.

SPEAKER_00 12:09

Yeah, I I love that is you have to put context to your decisions, is I think that is so important. And in fact, uh, you know, by the time this episode comes out, I've created a financial readiness plan template that people can go to my website to learn more about. Um but part of it is to create something that's a little bit more than a letter of instruction, but to provide context to the decisions that you make and to be able to record them and uh in writing so that people will know, because that's something that's often missed is you know, people oftentimes have really good reasons for making decisions in their legacy planning, but they don't tell anybody about them. And then, like you're talking about the kids are upset because they didn't feel like they got what they were expecting. And it's like maybe the person had a good reason, but if they're passed away, you don't know what that reason is.

SPEAKER_01 13:02

Yeah, and it's interesting because sometimes they don't know what to expect, and then they get hit by like a meteor when it happens, and it's it can be really surprising and jarring. Um, and I'll I'll share a story because I think this is important too. I think a lot of people spend a lot of time making decisions about what they're gonna do with their attorney, maybe as a couple, but they don't include their beneficiaries in the conversation, and that's a really missed step. And again, you don't have to talk about numbers per se, but you can talk about the thinking behind it and maybe percentages or what it is. And I'll give an example because I do a lot of work with step families along with uh the ultra-high net worth work that I do. I also do a lot of writing and I work for like I've written for Stepmom Magazine, and um I have some resources for step families because it's so fraught in terms of bringing families together and I, whatever I can do to support them, I want to. And there's an example of a family I worked with where um he wanted his children, two from a prior marriage and two together, treated equally. And she wanted the two that they had together treated fairly because the other two had a mother and they were gonna get benefit from their mother's estate, but their two children were only gonna benefit from their estate. And so she said it's only fair to treat them differently. And so they needed to come together in some way that made sense from both of their different values and what the history was and why they felt the way they did. And they worked with me. I did, I don't know, maybe three months of coaching with them. I looked at their, I do some archetypal work around money types and help them understand what was motivating them. And we looked at their values and their history, their money stories. And they came together and they came up with a solution that was quite unique and really original. And then I encouraged them to share it with all four of the children who were all adults before they signed on the dotted line to see if there was any additional thoughts or input that they might have because they're going to be the beneficiaries of what you're creating. And so I did they agreed, and so I did some pre-up like preliminary work with the children ahead of time. And these are like people in their late 30s and late 20s, and they had lives of their own and different ways, and um, so they were prepared and everybody knew it would be a safe space to have a conversation. And we the parents kind of gave their reveal about what they were thinking of for their plan and how they came up with it and why. And then the kids were fantastic because a couple things happened. One was that the older children who were closer in age to their stepmother, uh, said that they really thought that was great to know because they wanted her to live a long, healthy life, and that meant that they knew not to expect or count on any resources coming to them during their lifetime per se, but that it'll be useful for their children. And so that they know that they needed to really hunker down with their retirement planning and also the education for their children because the parents hadn't said anything about paying for their grandchildren's education in any way or any kind of lifetime giving. And the parents sat back and they said, Well, we'd be happy to help pay for some of the kids' tuition and their college, and we that's a value we hold dear. And the advisors that had referred me were like blown away because they were like, We have been talking about lifetime giving since we started working with them. You know, it's tax advantages, there's different accounts you can use, there's different ways you can do these things to set up generation skipping. And they were like, nope, nope, no, we're not gonna give any money while we're alive. And then when this happened, they were like, Oh, we can totally do that. And it was just this amazing opening that happened that had never been even on the table to consider because of how they had originally approached it. Uh, and so then they they set up some accounts for grandchildren, current and future. And that was super helpful. And then the other conversation they had that that I had to coach the parents to anticipate there might be some questions they're gonna have that are separate from what you're saying, was that one of the daughters was a physician, and she said, you know, dad, you've named me as your medical directive, uh, power of attorney, but I don't know what your wishes are, and I can never talk to you about it because you're always like offended, and I just want to make sure I'm doing what you want me to do. But he was uncomfortable talking about, you know, his mortality, and so he avoided the conversation. But because I was there facilitating it and they've had my coaching and we worked through it, they had a really important conversation about end-of-life wishes and uh all kinds of different things around health and wellness, and um, what if somebody has um memory loss but they're still physically well? Like all kinds of different things went to the DNR. And that daughter and the parents were so grateful because they'd never been able to have that conversation. So there's so much that can happen when you create a safe space where there's that ability to talk about the most burning questions that are on your mind about uh the future and what you want to have happen.

SPEAKER_00 18:05

Yeah, and I think you said, well, so much of what you said is amazing. I I think you know, one important takeaway is that if nobody knows your wishes, they can't follow through on them. And that's always something I come back to is that you have to somehow communicate your wishes if you want them acted upon. Otherwise, people are just gonna be, you know, like in this case, taking their best guess at it. And uh that's probably not in line with what you'd want.

SPEAKER_01 18:34

So and it can be hard if somebody thinks they know, and then somebody else says, No, I talked to dad, and he said no, and then you have contention among everybody. But if you do it together and there's transparency and everybody's getting the same information at the same time, and you have a record of it, it makes it so much easier in the time of crisis. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:52

Yeah. Well, I went through that uh, you know, with my mom and my sister, you know, when my mom was sick, is you know, we had a you know, different understanding. And so there was definitely tension, and it's not tension that goes away very easily or very quickly.

SPEAKER_01 19:09

No, we're talking about person's life and their well-being and their it's oh, I'm so sorry you went through that. And it's a very common occurrence. Um, my father's 91, and my brother and I were just visiting him, and we sat down with him, and my brother's a power of attorney and the durable power of attorney, and uh, and he said, Dad, I really want to understand like when does it when does a DNR go into effect? Because I get different messages from you. And then it became really obvious that it got very convoluted in his mind because he was talking about, well, you know, when I can't have uh control over my bladder and my bowel, we're just like, well, Dad, that's this isn't like a euthanizing area where like we can say, oh, he's lost his, you know, so he's mentally competent, but we're gonna no, you are gonna be absolutely taken care of to the best of our ability. But if you were to uh be um unconscious for some reason and you couldn't make a decision, are you saying that if you've gotten to the point where your body is starting to break down, that's our indication that there's no reason to resuscitate or to do any life-saving measures in that time? And he's yeah, that's what I'm trying to say. So we had to keep going back and forth to find out what what he really wanted and really drilling down with him. And um it it, you know, his he was tracking like two different conversations at the same time. And so we we needed to to help him sort that out, and it was really helpful for us um to hear it together, to help work through it together, and then write down his wishes so that our other brother can know it, and then we could have it added to the legal documents so that we knew that and we could uh give it to you know the medical professionals if they become involved.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

Yeah, and I think what you said there is super important is have everybody there at the same time and on the conversation so that they know that that's really what the person wanted, because that's the other thing in families that happens is somebody says, Well, you know, I think you're just sort of making it up. That's not what dad would have really wanted. And so that's where things get really dangerous. But if you put it in writing, you have conversations with everybody, is you can avoid some of that turmoil. And the way I look at it is it's a gift that you're leaving to your family, um, taking that off their shoulders. Um you know, besides you getting what you hope for, you know, besides having your wishes fulfilled, because it's one thing to have wishes, it's the other thing to have your wishes fulfilled.

SPEAKER_01 21:41

Yeah, it's interesting. I'm writing a book at the moment. Um, we're just finishing the manuscript um with Charles Feltman. Um it's called The Little Book of Trust and Money, an essential primer for families. Um, it's going to be coming out November 26th.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Cool.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

And it's there's a whole chapter devoted to transparency. How do you build the trust within the family so that you can have these conversations and have them go well? And what happens in families when you're not transparent and you hold secrets and you tell one person one thing that's something to somebody else, what kind of mischief that can cause and real discord. So uh we we've gone into quite a bit in terms of how to be sincere with each other and share what's on your heart and on your mind related to topics around money uh to support families on that. And that's that, yeah, that's one of the chapters is on transparency.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

Cool, cool. Well, look forward to checking out that book. It sounds like a great book, is because trust is so important. And actually, that was pretty much the next question. It is why is a framework of trust essential in this area?

SPEAKER_01 22:53

Well, because every time we're making a financial decision, there's some sort of trust involved, right? Trust that, you know, I'm gonna do this transaction and I'm gonna get what I've um paid for. Or within a family system, it could be, you know, I'm trusting you with this credit card and that you're gonna use it the way it's been intended, and uh that you're gonna pay back um with interest what you don't, what you've bought that's not part of it, right? But parents seldom have conversations at that degree, right? It's more like, oh yeah, you can use a credit card for gas and you know, um like they might give them very broad ways of and for medical emergencies or something like that. And then you know, they get the credit card bill and there's you know, Netflix's on it, or some Uber rides, or uh Uber Eats, or you know, whatever it might be, like that they might use it for. Uh, and you know, maybe the parent doesn't pay attention right away or they ignore it because it's just a few things, but it adds up over time, and then more and more things might get used and say, Oh, we never really set up really clear parameters about what this is for and how to use it. So uh that becomes a really important conversation to have around this is what this is for, this is when you can use it, this is when you need to be doing your own spending with your own money, um, or you need to be, you know, reimbursing us if you're using this because it's convenient uh right away by sending us a Venmo through your account, whatever it is, but there needs to be accountability with this. And so that's a whole other aspect in terms of trust is how you go about setting up your uh understanding of what your agreements are and your decisions around how money is being used in the family and as a couple or with the kids. Um, and the idea is, you know, as a child in the family grows up and becomes more trustworthy because they become more mature, they're given more access to money and ways of spending and saving and giving. And and you can bring intentionality to that to really build their skills around their financial lives so that they can be even more trustworthy with money as they become adults. So, like that's one example, like how to operationalize it. And in the book, we have a framework where it talks about trust in four different domains. So one is sincerity and that can be used with transparency, and then the other is reliability, right? So is somebody doing what they say consistently, um, and are they reliable? Can you really depend on them? Um, and that's the easiest one to help repair trust if it's been broken, is because you can observe and measure if somebody's reliable, right? And you can you can look at actual fulfillment of promises and what you're supposed to do related to the money uh that can help to re-establish trust if it's been broken in some way. Uh, and then uh there's competence. So do you actually have the ability to do what you say you're going to do? And you know, I'll liken this to like my my 13-year-old granddaughter saying she'd take me to the airport, and you know, she might be totally sincere, she might be completely reliable, but I she's not competent. She's not given she doesn't have a driver's license, she's never driven before, right? So it doesn't mean that I don't trust her as a human being, but I wouldn't trust her to take me to the airport because she's not competent at it yet. So being like really honest about somebody's competence is super important, especially in families, right? Like if somebody has is struggling, like maybe they have um uh like a mental health challenge or an addiction or something that would completely make them unreliable or incompetent in the domain of money because they have something else that's driving those decisions that isn't necessarily logical or rational, um, that uh is not going to be in their best interest to have full access to the financial resources that somebody who is, you know, mentally healthy and has educated and done and shown up consistently making good choices about how they spend and save would be in terms of trusting them with more resources. So competence. And then the last one is care. You know, do we care about what each other care about? And how do we demonstrate that care with each other? And families need to be really careful about their care because sometimes it can fall into what might be called enmeshment or enabling, like where because I care about somebody, I keep giving them money even though they're not showing up as responsible because that's how I show my love for them, which is could be to their detriment. So there's ways to show care that can also be with giving somebody clear boundaries or clear um guardrails uh as well, depending on how trustworthy they are in the other domains. So that's it helps you contextualize where the trust has been broken down and how to fix it.

SPEAKER_00 27:55

I like that. And you have to know where something is broken down before you can fix it. Uh but I I I like those domains as you went through them. It's you know, competence is something sometimes we don't talk about in terms of you know, legacy planning and you know, or or just money overall, is that people may have different capabilities or resources, and all these things really come into pray, play, not pray into play. Uh so uh, you know, one of the questions I want to ask you is, you know, you talk about inheritance trauma. What is inheritance trauma?

SPEAKER_01 28:35

Oh, how much time do we have? So I think this is I think it's really important for people to be aware of this because when somebody is completely in the dark and there's this void related to what they're inheriting, and then they suddenly find themselves inheriting it, and they have not been prepared adequately for it, it has been likened to a meteoric event. Like you know something's coming, you don't know how big, you don't know when it's gonna hit, but the moment it does, your life is dramatically changed and will never be the same, right? You've lost some typically it means you've lost a loved one, and it means you've gained something in terms of financially, but there might also be all kinds of rules and restrictions and having to work with a trustee going forward, and and it's like there's a whole other language in the financial world, and it's there's so much jargon and there's so many things to understand. And there's um a great analogy that's been used in this space for quite a while, which is the idea of um being a foreigner in a foreign land, right? Like if you are raised in Paris and you only go to English-speaking schools and you only speak English at home, and everybody who works in your home speaks English, and you're never exposed to anybody who speaks French, your entire time you're in Paris, and then you become 18 or 21 or 25, whatever the age is of your inheritance, whatever it might be, and suddenly you're told you now need to be completely fluent in French and be successful in Paris without knowing how to speak the language, you've put somebody at a real disadvantage and it can be quite traumatic. And then the other is just how inheritance is uh by how it's designed is often connected to the loss of someone, right? You receive an inheritance oftentimes, like the majority of it when a parent or a grandparent has passed away. And in those instances, there's so much grief and loss and unresolved issues related to that parent. And then the money becomes fraught with that. So it's kind of like I, you know, I need to be grateful for this money, I need to be smart about it. I'm not sure exactly how they would want me to use it, like we've been talking about, because they haven't necessarily articulated their wishes, or suddenly you find out there's all these wishes and all these like demands and concerns, and it's kind of like being controlled from the grave, like so it can go both ways, right? And it's that when there isn't that transparent communication, when there isn't that inclusion, and somebody receives an inheritance, um, it can have a lot of emotional um repercussions in their lives, for sure. And then the other place I'll say is for people that do receive an inheritance or are part of a family that like maybe the name is known, or um, they they it brings them to another status in life than they were before. Uh it can really have an impact on their relationships. When somebody finds out that they've inherited money, they're seen differently, they're treated differently. If they start being generous with their friends in different ways, they might find that their friends start expecting them to pay more. And it just, as soon as money enters into the relationship, it changes the dynamic and there becomes power differentials and it it can become really loaded for people. So um feeling equipped and having a community of people that are going through something similar can be really helpful because it can feel kind of isolating too.

SPEAKER_00 32:09

Yeah, I can imagine because you know, we all think of wow, it'd be great if we just you know inherited a whole pile of money. And it definitely has its plus sides, but I think you know, we don't talk about the the negatives, and you can see that happening with people who win the lottery, with looking at how few businesses, you know, continue past one or two generations. Um, I have a friend who works with professional athletes, and he talks about how most professional athletes, you know, are broke after, you know, a couple of years after retiring, even though they have huge contracts.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

So sad. And they like they're seen as the family bank, and there's tons of entitlement and presumptions within their family system. It becomes really hard on them. And yeah, and there's other things too, in terms of the inheritance I also want to share that um it doesn't have to be a huge amount of money. Like I share the story about a woman I met on a plane where she um when she found out what I did and the kind of work I do, she shared that she and her brother no longer spoke because of a vase. Um, that they they couldn't resolve who should get a vase because there were so many other unresolved issues related to their inheritance when their parents both passed away, that the vase just became a symbol of that um inability to come to uh some sort of meeting of the minds in terms of what this needed to look like. And there was only one vase, and there was two of them, and what is this gonna look like? And uh and it it really represented for them how their relationship was so torn because of how they were treated in the state, uh, you know, because it couldn't be equal, it had to be fairer in terms of how the parents did it, and they just never had talked about it as a family, and then the two of them were left having to figure it out together.

SPEAKER_00 34:02

Yeah, well, I think that's just important is that why families need to talk is these things, and you know, and maybe it's not even resolvable, you know, in certain situations is maybe it's not resolvable, even if you have a family conversation, but at least it's an effort at trying to resolve it. Uh, you know, because I know from some cousins is that there were issues with property when the parents passed away, and some of the siblings still don't talk to each other after, you know, more than a decade. And it's pretty much a base story, not a millions of dollars story.

SPEAKER_01 34:41

Happens all the time. And it's um, and it, you know, it's interesting because we talk about, oh, you have to talk about it. But if you don't know how to do that and you don't know how to have these conversations go well, you either avoid them because you don't want them to devolve, or you have them and then people, you know, there's conflict and they blow apart because people don't know how to manage and move with conflict. And so that's the thing I really love is showing people how to have these conversations and have them go well. And it's not rocket science, and there's lots of ways to do it, um, but it's it's not avoiding those conversations. And I often recommend uh Patrick Lancioni's book, you know, The Five Dysfunctions of a Team, because even though it's business related and it's talking about a team, you can get so much from it in terms of like how do you establish authentic trust? And he uses a phrase that people really understand, which is artificial harmony. And in families, we so often will have this artificial harmony between each other, kind of go along to get along. And you know, everybody can talk about certain topics at Thanksgiving, but not other topics. But once people have had a couple of glasses of wine, you know, things will start. And it's like, well, there's other ways to do it, and there's ways to actually have uh really authentic harmony and relating um that allow for differences and allow for everybody's voice to be heard. And when you learn how to do that, you you're really set up for success in life, right? Because when you can manage the difficult conversations and have them go well, you're gonna be so much ahead of the game.

SPEAKER_00 36:11

Definitely. Well, do you have any quick tips for people on how to have these conversations?

SPEAKER_01 36:16

Um, you know, I wrote um, I wrote a little book. It's not um, it's it's smaller than a reader's digest, and it's called The Beginner's Guide to Purposeful Prenups. And it's designed to support couples and having these difficult conversations before they get married to strengthen their marriage. And uh the recommendations in that book can be used by anybody. It could be used by siblings, it could be used within families across generations, even though it's geared towards couples. Uh, but it's all about connecting around shared values and really getting clear about where those values come from, sharing money stories, what are the memories that you have that really shaped your relationship to money and what um you feel strengthens your relationship with money, what you find hinders it, and uh creating a space where it's safe to um talk about vulnerabilities, mistakes, uh transgressions, uh not having judgment with each other, but having a sense of we're all human and we're all gonna be making mistakes with money. I mean, I talked on one podcast um about a story that was so she was so blown away by it, where research has shown that every child at a certain point has had the experience of taking some money that they shouldn't have. It's part of our development in terms of um learning about money and it's how that's handled when it's discovered that has an impact on how you are with money going forward. And the host of the podcast said, Oh my gosh, I've never told my husband about when I took some money. And I was like, Well, if you have that story to tell, maybe that'll be an interesting thing in your relationship. And maybe he has a story from his childhood too. But it was so liberating for her to realize it's not, I'm not the only one that did something like that I shouldn't have. It's like everybody does, and it's like it just it's part of the human experience. And the more you can really understand each other and your experience with money and what that what happened and how it was handled, and what you learned, what you heard, what you saw, you know, what what you witnessed has a huge impact on us in terms of our development around our trust with ourselves, trust with others, our relationship with money. We go into that a lot in the care chapter in the book, um, ways to think about that and how to be able to really operationalize care and talk about what does it mean in terms of money. And then that's your foundation that you can go back to when things get more difficult. Like, for the sake of what are we having this conversation? Well, because I care about you and I want to find out a way to make this right for everyone, right? Like, it's a different conversation than pointing fingers, and this is what you said. No, this is what you said. It's like, well, no, like how do what it let's look at this together. We're all on the same side. How do we want to work together to make this be an effective um resolution for everybody?

SPEAKER_00 39:10

So well, I think right there, that's pretty much a drop the mic moment. Is it's like, how do we want to work together? Is like, you know, that's such an important question, is because sometimes that's all it takes, is you know, is understanding that perspective. Um I love what you're talking about with the values and the money stories, because it gets back to what we talked about at the very beginning is you're not really talking about money. Um, money is just sort of the thing out there that's part of this, but there's there's so much more happening. So, Emily, to wrap up, I have what's called the get ready hot take trio. And these are three quick questions I ask all of my guests. The first one is what's one money myth you're trying to break?

SPEAKER_01 39:54

A money myth I'm trying to break? Uh, this erroneous belief that money is the root of all evil, because that is a incorrectly quoted statement. And it's actually the uh love of money or greed is the root of all evil. So if you're gonna use that quote, use it correctly. Money is just an energetic form of uh expression and makes it easy for us to have transactions with each other as opposed to having to bring a bushel of pumpkins to trade for your candlesticks you made. You know, it's just we we've made it easier for us to transact with each other and it's just taken on a life of its own.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

Yeah, it it all the things that we've put onto money are just make it so much more challenging. And like you said, it's just it's just something. If if we didn't have money, I mean, would people trade seashells at one point? I know in I read some historical fiction, they traded slivers of silver and things like that, you know. I mean, thousands of years ago, but you know, we've always had some medium of trade. But that's that's all money really is, it's a medium. So I love that myth. So let's get out the time machine for a minute. If we could go back in time, knowing what you know now about money, what advice would you give your younger self?

SPEAKER_01 41:13

Oh my gosh, I can imagine everybody saying this, but Einstein said the most powerful force in the universe is compounding interest. And it's the sort of thing where if my younger self really understood that and immediately started saving and just continued to save every week, every month, every year, that little bit would have compounded to be a lot more than what I have right now. So that it's an extraordinary thing when you get to see it in action. And what a simple small act can do over time is just so extraordinary. That's the ultimate thing to leverage.

SPEAKER_00 41:54

You know, I mean one, yeah, compound interest is definitely by far the leading thing that people say here. But I think what you said is so beautiful. What a simple small act repeated over time can do is that not just with money, but that just is striking me so deeply is just because it's anything that you do over time, small, simple acts of gratitude, of friendliness or whatever that that all these things compound over time.

SPEAKER_01 42:30

Oh, yeah, kindness. Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

So I absolutely love that. That's wonderful. Thanks for sharing. Um, so to wrap up, what's your number one tip to change the way we think about money?

SPEAKER_01 42:44

Oh, I love this. I'm gonna go back and listen to all your shows and hear what other people say. Um I think the most important thing I've seen is to shine a light on where you feel the most shame or unresolved areas around money, because when we keep that in the dark and we feel like we're the only one that's done it, or it's unforgivable, or anytime there's regret, like find where there's any kind of regret around money, like a I don't know, a bad financial decision you made, or when you got scammed, or whatever it might be, everybody's had different experiences. If there's a way to bring self-compassion, self-forgiveness, and healing to it, and really look at how you can learn, things will start to shift. When we keep something held in a shameful place and in the dark, it tends to have a life of its own and it keeps us from being able to move differently. And even though if we think, oh no, I have to keep on holding this and berate myself repeatedly for this mistake, that that's somehow going to keep me from having it happen again. It maybe, but at the same time, it actually can help sabotage us in terms of being much more successful. And I think that I'd like to go back to that thing about the incremental things, like small incremental things. If you have, if you like if you have something big happening in your life around money, whether it's debt or taxes or um needing to pay for, I don't know, child's college, whatever it is, start now, start small and build it up slowly over time or um incrementally and make make it a small regular action so that it becomes doable.

SPEAKER_00 44:28

Definitely. Yeah, just think of a snowball. Start small and it gets bigger.

SPEAKER_01 44:33

It's bigger.

unknown 44:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:34

So I love that. So, Emily, where can people learn more about you, your work, and tune in to your podcast, the wealth coherence podcast?

SPEAKER_01 44:42

Oh, thank you. Uh, so wealth coherence can be found on YouTube or Apple or Spotify, anywhere you listen to podcasts and basically focus on uh true meaning of wealth, which is well-being. So I focus on the non-financial aspect of wealth, like our health, our emotional well-being, our um leadership, like the different uh other aspects of our lives um that make it a truly rich life. And uh you can find me at Emilybouchard.com. Like I tried to keep it simple with just the name. And then I'm on LinkedIn. I'm really active on LinkedIn. I have a newsletter there and um post regularly. So that's a good place too.

SPEAKER_00 45:24

Fantastic. And for everybody watching and listening, if you have access to the show notes, you'll be able to find all those links in the show notes. Emily, thanks for joining us on Get Ready Before Life Happens.

SPEAKER_01 45:35

Thanks so much, Tony. It was a total delight.

SPEAKER_00 45:38

Yeah, this was a lot of fun. And thank you, everyone, as always, for tuning in to this episode of Get Ready Before Life Happens. If you learned something today to change the way you think about money, please be sure to subscribe and to share with a friend. You can also join the get ready movement at Tony Stewart.com to receive my newsletter and access to a whole bunch of free resources. If you want to support the podcast, you can go to buymeacoffee.com slash Tony Stewart and support the podcast. Because when life happens, the way you think about money matters.